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Posted on 21 May 12 at 20:19 |
Vorpal Smilodon has just submitted some Game Info for http://www.trueachievements.com/The-Force-Unleashed-xbo....htm:
Sub Genre change from [No Sub-Genre] to Hack & Slash
Vorpal Smilodon said:I guess you could put it under Action-Adventure instead, but mostly the "puzzles" just involved using force pull on objects
see also: http://www.trueachievements.com/Force-Unleashed-II-xbox....htm |
Last post: Today at 13:34
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Posted on 24 May 12 at 05:26 |
| Thanks for your submission. Unfortunately after discussing with the team, we have decided not to change the genre for this game. |
"You must exceed your limitations if you wish to survive..." |
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Posted on 31 May 12 at 06:33 |
Vorpal Smilodon has just submitted some Game Info for http://www.trueachievements.com/The-Force-Unleashed-xbo....htm:
Sub Genre change from [No Sub-Genre] to Hack & Slash
Vorpal Smilodon said:Hack & Slash games usually feature a lone or a small group of characters who need to defeat large numbers of enemies, usually using melee weapons.You hack'n'slash your way through large numbers of enemies and the occasional boss. |
Last post: 01 May at 19:51
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Posted on 31 May 12 at 07:45 |
| you dont need to submit the same thing twice.....and he already said no. |
Remember, science rhymes with compliance. Do you know what doesn't rhyme with compliance? NEUROTOXIN |
Last post: 13 May at 21:02
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Posted on 31 May 12 at 08:32 |
| I was hoping to find out the reasoning behind the decision, and the only way to get the thread out of the archive is to make another submission |
Last post: 01 May at 19:51
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Posted on 31 May 12 at 08:41 |
| im just going to assume sending him a message would have worked better. |
Remember, science rhymes with compliance. Do you know what doesn't rhyme with compliance? NEUROTOXIN |
Last post: 13 May at 21:02
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Posted on 31 May 12 at 08:49 |
| well, then it wouldn't be a matter of public record for the next time someone suggests a genrechange for the game |
Last post: 01 May at 19:51
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Posted on 31 May 12 at 09:09 |
| hmm, that is a good point. lets see what shadow enz has to say on hack&slash! |
Remember, science rhymes with compliance. Do you know what doesn't rhyme with compliance? NEUROTOXIN |
Last post: Today at 19:34
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Posted on 31 May 12 at 10:31 |
You could just have left a message in the archives though! We do look there too!  But your point is valid and we apologise for not giving you the details the first time around.
Your submission had already been considered and dismissed. We are not overthrowing that decision. The reason for the dismissal are the gameplay elements that are not purely common to H&S games. Please do consider H&S in our usage context. http://www.trueachievements.com/The-Force-Unleashed-xbo....htm does feature puzzles and, limited, exploration. There are collectables and most importantly, the combat system is not your usual H&S style button masher where weak enemies cross the River Styx in abundance. The game promotes the use of combos but using all of your abilities is key to beat the game as there is often no progressing with typical H&S style tactics. Given, the game has somewhat taken a more H&S approach than the first instalment but we do not believe the game fits well with what we consider H&S games. |
Last post: 13 May at 21:02
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Posted on 31 May 12 at 15:36, Edited on 01 June 12 at 10:21 by Vorpal Smilodon |
[I'll remember to contact the team in a less annoying manner next time I want to resurrect a thread, sorry] 
Nearly all games in the Hack'n'Slash genre feature collectables - excepting the Dynasty Warriors series with it's random drops, many other games have specific locations you have to search out to collect hidden items, weapons or upgrade points
Numerous also feature weak puzzles (Bayonetta had several required to progress further, mostly focusing on her time-slowing power also not that common in HacknSlash, that are more complicated than those in SWtFU for instance), though I might be misremembering the game because I did not think the Force Unleashed had many puzzles at all...
The number of enemies isn't comparable to the Dynasty Warriors franchise, but certainly there are as many in SWtFU as in Devil May Cry, Knights Contract, Bayonetta, Ninja Blade, Ninja Gaiden - all of the skill-based Hack'n'Slash games that focus more on combos, timing and dodging rather than simple button mashing. |
Last post: Today at 19:34
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Posted on 02 June 12 at 08:11 |
http://www.trueachievements.com/The-Force-Unleashed-xbo....htm does not promote or reward the use of hefty combos on enemies. It promotes the use of your environment and traversal is of big importance. At no point in my playthrough of the game did it feel like a H&S game. Not even once! But that is of no importance.
You are welcome to submit new arguments as the ones you provided have been considered and rejected. I would however ask you to hold back on comparisons to other games.. |
Last post: 01 May at 19:51
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Posted on 02 June 12 at 08:40 |
| i dont really care for changing the genre of this game but....it really never felt like an H&S to you? reminded me somewhat of dynasty warriors, and you cant get more H&s than that. |
Remember, science rhymes with compliance. Do you know what doesn't rhyme with compliance? NEUROTOXIN |
Last post: Today at 13:34
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Posted on 02 June 12 at 08:55, Edited on 02 June 12 at 08:56 by Shadow Enz |
My first completion through the game I did not use the lightsaber at all. That should tell you something about its genre. I was working on those Force Power achievements and didn't bother hacking or slashing anything.
I was grabbing and pushing my way through the game. A hack and slash shouldn't let you be able to do that.
I don't know if you could "shoot" your way through Devil May Cry, for example. Not as easily as avoiding the lightsaber in this game, especially. |
"You must exceed your limitations if you wish to survive..." |
Last post: 13 May at 21:02
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Posted on 02 June 12 at 10:44, Edited on 02 June 12 at 10:50 by Vorpal Smilodon |
I hadn't considered it before reading your arguments as to why SWtFU isn't a Hack'n'Slash game, but I'd like to suggest it as an Action Adventure because I don't see how a game that has too many non-action gameplay elements to be a Hack'n'Slash fits any better in the Action parent-genre
Genre Info said:Action-Adventure games combine elements of Action and Adventure, as the name suggests. A game in this genre might incorporate a strong storyline,- SWtFU certainly had a -good- storyline, though I'm not sure what is required to consider a game's story strong
exploration of the game environment,- as you said, the game features exploration as well as collectables
peaceful interaction with non-player characters and puzzle solving, among others, to complement and give context to its action mechanics.- has enough puzzle-solving that it can't be considered Hack'n'Slash
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I have to ask why you don't want me comparing to other games, as looking at what other games fit into a genre seems like the most obvious way of determining what sorts of games fit there
http://www.trueachievements.com/ENSLAVED-xbox-360.htm for example has a similar mix of platforming, melee and ranged combat and exploration, though Enslaved certainly has more NPC involvement than SWtFU does. |
Last post: Today at 19:34
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Posted on 02 June 12 at 20:17 |
Comparisons are discouraged because they provide a means to start arguments that can be avoided if we can keep all on the same page as to how games are to be evaluated. We consider every game on its own with the exceptions of sequels which we try to somewhat keep together. We extract the core gameplay elements and weigh them. Then we see where it would fit. We are going top-down if you want.
What comparisons do is go from the other direction. You try to align or compare the game and make it fit although no exact fit exists. This causes you to switch from one genre to the next if a proposal gets dismissed. First identifying gameplay elements should enable you to more easily see if it fits in the first place. |
Last post: 13 May at 21:02
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Posted on 02 June 12 at 21:18 |
Okay, that makes sense! I actually like the sound of this method more than the guesswork of comparing games I've been relying on so far. What are the core gameplay elements in SWtFU then?
Combat
- lightsaber
- force throw
- lightning
Puzzles
- extremely simple
Exploration
- platforming
- collectibles
Story
- extensive cutscenes and narration
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The genre info suggests that action games are very narrow in their scope - does that mean the breadth of gameplay in SWtFU makes it an Action-Adventure? |
Last post: Today at 19:34
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Posted on 02 June 12 at 22:57 |
| No. A game does not get shoved into the Action-Adventure genre just because it features a lot of different gameplay elements. |
Last post: 13 May at 21:02
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Posted on 03 June 12 at 07:46 |
| What are the requirements for a game to be placed in Action-Adventure? |
Last post: Today at 19:34
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Posted on 03 June 12 at 13:07 |
| Strong Action and Adventure elements, blended together into the delicious dough that makes the Action-Adventure cake so tasty! |
Last post: 13 May at 21:02
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Posted on 03 June 12 at 20:09, Edited on 19 July 12 at 13:43 by Vorpal Smilodon |
Hah :D
Seriously though, I was thinking more of a list of specific gameplay elements with meanings that aren't so encompassing as 'Action' or 'Adventure' Grand Theft Auto isn't exactly a mix of Pac-Man and the Secret of Monkey Island
edit: are you sure game comparisons are invalid arguments? SWtFU has awfully simliar gameplay to http://www.trueachievements.com/Castlevania-LoS-xbox-360.htm |