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Yet Another Zombie Defense HD Multi-Genre Discussion

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Information Posted on 14 April 19 at 20:17
Please use this thread to discuss this game's classification under the multi-genre system.

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Information Posted on 14 April 19 at 21:09
Redanian has registered their disagreement about the genres applied to this game
This game isn't a tower defence so I think it should have the tag removed. It's essentially just a watered-down horde mode game with no objective to defend and the only thing to do is shoot zombie and survive. It doesn't have anything that I'd classify as tower defence and doesn't share any similarities with other TD games I've played.
IcyThrasher
550,033
IcyThrasher
Posted on 14 April 19 at 22:51
It's a game that could go either way. I think it fits a loose discription of tower defense. You are what is being defended. There are also plenty of different towers to choose from. Every weapon you purchase can be turned into a turret attacking tower.
Redanian
470,769
Redanian
Posted on 14 April 19 at 23:37
IcyThrasher said:
It's a game that could go either way. I think it fits a loose discription of tower defense. You are what is being defended. There are also plenty of different towers to choose from. Every weapon you purchase can be turned into a turret attacking tower.
I'm just going off of TA's definition of tower defence here:

Tower Defense games have the player defending a specific item or area on the map from enemy attacks.
This is a major part of all tower defence games and it's not present here in the slightest. Enemies spawn from all sides of the map and run at you and ignore everything else. There are no paths or lanes as seen in pretty much every tower defence game because this is simply a shoot-em-up where the objective is to survive as long as possible. It was also explained in the Smite genre discussion thread that having towers/turrets present is not an indication of tower defence.

Horde mode in Gears of War also involves purchasing weapons and turrets whilst fighting waves of enemies that are solely trying to kill you but nobody would ever consider that to be tower defence.
Elyoh
671,130
Elyoh
Posted on 15 April 19 at 01:03
I agree with Redanian on this, it's essentially a horde mode, not a tower defence.
No God, know fear. Know God, no fear.
IcyThrasher
550,033
IcyThrasher
Posted on 15 April 19 at 13:25
The reason I say it can go either way is because I think a key element of tower defense games is a game that revolves around waves of enemies that gradually gets stronger with amount and types of enemies with a build phase in between every or every few waves. This game fits that to a T.

As far as the area of the map you are defending, that would be the lit up area with the lamp post so that you can see what you're killing. But I agree, there is no item/object or portal or anything that the zombies are walking towards.

As far as your Smite comment about towers just being present... Unlike in Smite, the whole game revolves around you building and upgrading towers to defend yourself with. You're not getting very far otherwise.
Eurydace
488,085
Eurydace
Posted on 15 April 19 at 13:51
I also agree this is tower defense. There’s not a lot of difference between horde modes and tower defense. In fact, there’s significant overlap. A game can be both.
Redanian
470,769
Redanian
Posted on 15 April 19 at 14:11
But what you're describing is horde mode in Gears of War and like I said nobody would ever consider that to be a tower defence. I personally cannot think of a single game of this nature that is considered to be a tower defence.

My Smite comment was to highlight that having turrets and towers in the game does not constitute the game being a tower defence. It was clearly explained to a user in Smite's genre thread who wanted to add strategy and tower defence to the game just to further his position on the site leaderboards for those genres.
IcyThrasher
550,033
IcyThrasher
Posted on 16 April 19 at 14:14
I haven't played horde recently and barely remember anything from it. But if it was a stand alone game, involved 6sh or more different kinds of automated towers, involves walls and booby traps that the player constructs and or upgrades, and is about defending yourself from waves of enemies that gradually get stronger with a build phase in between.. I would be providing arguments for why people would categorize it as tower defense
Redanian
470,769
Redanian
Posted on 16 April 19 at 14:49
Every single tower defence game I've played and have seen has the player defending an objective, not themselves. Both TA and Google's definition of tower defence as a genre state in the very first sentence that it's about defending an objective and I think you'd struggle to find examples of objectiveless horde games that are universally classified as tower defence.

This game has no objective other than 'survive' so it is not a tower defence as you are not defending anything and doesn't fit TA's criteria.
IcyThrasher
550,033
IcyThrasher
Posted on 16 April 19 at 17:26
You are defending yourself and maybe 1-3 other party members and the game ends when you all die. It looks like the main thing you are arguing is whether or not you (a moving controlled unit that can fight) can be concidered the objective or whether it MUST be an item that gets retrieved and brought back through the level, location where creeps dissappear doing damage to health or something, object that gets attacked continuously until destroyed, etc...

I'm just saying, some would lean towards including it in that long list of thongs we traditionally know as Tower Defense games and some (like yourself) would not.

What if there was a game identical to this one but when a zombie attacked you it would just link to you and become invulnerable. Then the next time a zombie attacked you or the zombie linked to you, it would then add to the link so on and so forth as if you were building a snake of zombies. Then once you've accumulated 10 zombies in the link, the game was over. Would you consider that a Tower Defense game?

You had 10 hp essentially, 10 attacks from 10 separate zombies. Your objective, use the towers and weapons to prevent getting hit by 10 separate zombies, thus avoiding a snake chain of 10 zombies. And you can move.

Now just compare that to this game, you get hit 10 times and you die. You can move though. You are a moving object with hp and once taken so many hits you crumble to dust and the game ends.
Redanian
470,769
Redanian
Posted on 16 April 19 at 17:36
I'm taking everything you say with a pinch of salt because I believe the reason you are trying so hard to keep this tagged as tower defence is because you actively track yourself on the genre leaderboard for it and would like this game to remain added so it can increase your standing.

I am not prepared to take part in your strawman and discuss some hypothetical game that you have just created because that is not the discussion.

As I've said - this game does not fit TA's definition of tower defence and I am now doubting that you could give me a single example of a survival shoot-em-up like this that is generally considered to be a tower defence.
IcyThrasher
550,033
IcyThrasher
Posted on 16 April 19 at 18:15
No worries, i go both ways on the argument. I actively try to be unbiased but obviously that is impossible and it is irrelevant as I agree with the points you made lol. A lot of this threads is just because I like discussing this kind of stuff and very rarely does anyone actually discuss. And I actively like to play games that are or similar to Tower Defense games and I wouldn't have found this otherwise. So if determined that it was incorrectly labeled, I'm just glad I found it beforehand.

I just wanted to provide the probable reasons people voted for tower defense in the first place as not many people show up to debate and the genre team is left with little to know information, opinions, or views other than footage or their own game play to go off of. Think what you want though, not sure how my view or bias has anything to do with the points I made unless you concider them to be false, wrong, or exagerated.

On a side note, If you know of any other survival games like this that incorporate building mechanics like towers and barriers and what not and are on the 360 or Xbox 1, I would appreciate a PM with them. I'd love to check them out and play them when I got some downtime. I miss the good ol days of warcraft 3 frozen throne custom games ='(
Elyoh
671,130
Elyoh
Posted on 17 April 19 at 00:53, Edited on 17 April 19 at 00:54 by Elyoh
Eurydace said:
I also agree this is tower defense. There’s not a lot of difference between horde modes and tower defense. In fact, there’s significant overlap. A game can be both.
Tower defence is about defending something other than yourself. Horde is about defending yourself. That's the biggest differentiation between them, and an important one to note.

IcyThrasher said:
I miss the good ol days of warcraft 3 frozen throne custom games ='(
You can say that again...
No God, know fear. Know God, no fear.
IcyThrasher
550,033
IcyThrasher
Posted on 18 April 19 at 21:29
Elyoh said:
Tower defence is about defending something other than yourself. Horde is about defending yourself. That's the biggest differentiation between them, and an important one to note.
Looks like the team agrees with you here, as the game no longer has Tower Defense tagged =)
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