Posted on 04 March 21 at 06:17ShadowRaven9 said:bigsmok3r said:thebritt2001 said:ShadowRaven9 said:ShadowRaven9 said:bigsmok3r said:No point, All the games bar 1 or 2 have been completed already. Great job enforcing TA! Said no-one everImagine playing Xbox games for the sole purpose of being number 1 on a leaderboard seen only on this site.Achievements have ruined gaming for the sake of gaming IMOTo double down on my comment, I dont think TA should cater to the users that take achievement hunting to the nth extreme. What do I mean by this?Obsessing over 1st on EVERY leaderboards or something like having an account solely to have "100%" completion on all games is a bit much. Ive seen some super odd behavior on this site lol I hope Im not saying anything "shocking" though and Im not trying to pick on anyone in particular. Its all in the name of "dude, settle down a tiny bit". Alas, if this site had a downvote comment feature, Im sure id be in the pits by now.I did just say similar in my last post, but to reply to you; not everyone wants to play games the way that you do. As their gaming habits don't impact you, why are you trying to stop them from doing what they wish? Personally, I couldn't care less about fast completions, I barely care all that much about 100 percenting everything, but that doesn't mean everyone has to play the way I play. I hate sports games, doesn't mean I begrudge anyone else from playing them! Why should I? It does me no harm, doesn't impact the way I play. So why are you hassling these guys? I don't understand!You say achievements ruined everything, but it's nonsense. I don't know how old you are, mate, but if you ever read the old gaming magazines, they had whole sections dedicated to gaming records, they even had leaderboards in them! Friend of mine used to try to get fastest times in racing games when we were kids, recorded himself and sent his videos into the magazine. He even got in that hallowed first place more than once. The desire has been there long, long before achievements.Again, I don't care for it. It doesn't seem fun to me. But he enjoyed that sense of accomplishment. Just as someone feels success in painting something. It's no masterpiece for museums, but it doesn't mean they don't feel some sense of achievement (ha) nevertheless. Some people feel a sense of accomplishment just tidying their house even! Why would you put them down for doing what they like?This too hahaIf you wanna compare competing in competitions for like Pac-Man, or 'World First' which has been done in WoW and other MMO's to getting the first 100% in a game for achievement then I see a bit of a stretch. If the people who got the 100% in the number one spot got it via legitimate means, then dont they deserve to get spot 1? Because a release date hasnt passed? What if the dev wanted them to have early access? If you think its illegitimate, the site has a system to report people... So see how that goes? If TA Investigations finds something, I bet they are removed from the leader board.Also, if you think the "Leaderboard for when the first day the game is made available, Put it in as a feature request, but know there are numerous ways to a game can come out before then. Region locks are a thing too so NA could get a game before JA or EU or any other combo.I side with giving people goals, but they shouldnt complain when the goal they set for themselves is logically impossible. The people who have unlocked the achievements have done so 100% legit if they have no been reported and found guilty of foulplay but the mods. Achievements have ruined the approach I personally have for games and Im sure it has too even for people who dont admit it. I like a decent goal but a number increasing can be a curse sometimes too.I'll try to limit my response here, because I don't think the comments section of a random article is the best place for philosophical nature of achievements and achievement hunting. Suffice to say, your approach to achievements is your own. If you feel you have an unhealthy relationship with achievements, it is down to you to fix it. Recognising you have a problem is the road to recovery. This isn't meant to be a sly dig, achievements *can* be addictive, just as video games can be addictive. The medium itself is not the cause of your problems, it's your own indulgence of the thing.You have missed a few comments, all of which say that these guys have already spoken to TA staff on the issue of unfair leaderboards and wish for steps to be taken and have made proposals. It's a conversation I am mostly Devil's Advocate for.Legitimacy is legal until it is recognised as not. As with the real law, unethical means are often exploited until that gap is plugged by law. The current situation is unethical. There is an elite class of achievement hunters who have an unfair advantage over everyone else. It is that simple. Until the playing field is rendered *as fair as possible*, complaints will occur. Your comparisons are incredibly far off the mark. If your argument against altering the leaderboard conditions is that someone will always have an unfair advantage, then why endeavour to make it fair at all? If you're going to create a leaderboard that is meant to be fair for as many as possible, then it needs to reflect that. Allowing footfall teams to be placed into the final round of a match because they have 'early access' is not fair and not a true representation of skill. What if all the developers themselves decide to get the achievements themselves and put themselves on the board? Would that be okay? There are always loopholes and exploitations, but this could easily be resolved with the earlier suggestion. There's really no excuse. As you clearly don't care about the leaderboards - as I don't - really there's just no point to defending this. It's unfair, there is a solution, that's and end to it. The only true defence would be the cost to the site to make an alteration, but the site does make changes constantly - after all, stagnation means decline, decline means death of the site. The small small change proposed earlier can be easily performed and nobody loses out, both those who exploited the early access and those who didn't.