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Lies of P Discussion - Spoilers

  • blastfreak23blastfreak23584,704
  • Posted on 22 August 24 at 14:17
    For anyone looking for a good and easy place to farm Ergo, I personally recommend the Arche Abbey Upper Part - Inside Stargazer. At least I’m pretty sure that’s the one, been a minute since I’ve played. If you look behind you from the Stargazer you can see off into the distance with some wooded scaffolding right behind you. And directly in front of you is an entry way inside the tower thing with multiple routes to take inside.

    Walk forward and a large corpse enemy will drop down in front of you. Slightly to your left is a short, dead end corridor, with a pressure plate in the middle. If you trigger the pressure plate and just run or dodge to the side, you can take out 1/3-1/2 of the big corpses health bar. From here either finish it off yourself, or wait a few seconds for the pressure plate to pop back up, and launch those electric spears right back into the corpse for the kill.

    The corpse itself yields a nice chunk of Ergo, but the icing on the cake is that the corpse will often drop Ergo chunks. Usually it’s only for a couple thousand Ergo, but fairly regularly it was dropping Ergo chunks that would yield 15,000 or more.

    To maximize this farming spot, make sure to equip your ring that increases Ergo yield, as well as the Noblesse Oblige special weapon.

    I hope this is of some help!!
  • TymanTheLongTymanTheLong555,819
    Posted on 24 August 24 at 20:52
    Vr English said:
    FruitofPassion said:
    Idk. Looking at a game dev perspective, back in the day playing DS1, you go the wrong way and you have a very bad time. Your brain goes "huh, maybe I'm not supposed to be here yet, let's try this other path." Yay this other way feels like the intended path.

    But over the years they gained a reputation as being "those really hard games." So some new to the franchise player comes along, goes the wrong way, has a bad time, but because they heard these games are really hard they accept this is just how it is and end up giving up in frustration. Any souls-like has inherited this same problem. As such the devs may want to design their worlds in a way that's much easier to know where to go, and focus more on the bosses and combat system. Even DS2 and DS3 did this (mostly xD)

    But DS1 was a huge maze, you could easily screw yourself going deep into late game territory. But that's also part of why it was so great. It was very unique in the way the world was intertwined through shortcuts and off the grid paths. They've never really attempted that again, nobody has. And I think the fear of gamers giving up in frustration of getting lost is part to blame.
    I mean I know a few examples of people who gave up on Elden Ring cuz they got frustrated at the tree sentinel at the start. They couldn't figure out it was designed to teach you to go somewhere else and come back later.
    I view the tree sentinel a bit like the skeletons. It encourages you to think.

    On topic, I'm not sure Lies of P really has anything like that. I didn't mind either particularly, I enjoyed that it had enclosed narrative. It did pick-up the unfortunate souls habit regarding NPCs though but relocating them to a hub was great. I enjoyed that the NG+ lead to different things too. Which Dark Souls 2 did but I haven't seen done since.
    Oh I definitely came back for that Tree Sentinel and when I did I showed him the error of his ways in the most humiliating manner possible!
  • TymanTheLongTymanTheLong555,819
    Posted on 24 August 24 at 20:52, Edited on 24 August 24 at 20:55 by TymanTheLong
    So, do we think this story, or at least many elements, are allegorical?

    There are really a lot of elements to the story that could be considered parallels to real life class struggle, especially in the early 20th century of the US and much of Europe. The puppets really are the scary monsters of the game much as early union efforts were boogeymen to the upper classes of the time.

    I’m not historian but I find that many people don’t really know how much violence occurred around the early union and worker movements. Owners hired armed thugs and private armies to simply murder workers into submission. This is what many groups like the Pinkertons decided was “good business” at the time. This lasted only so long as it took workers to arm themselves, usually having more men and sometimes canons and gatling guns (these were people who actually made stuff, so making a cannon was possible for them), the workers often smashed the thugs hired to kill them and force the remainder back to work. In one hilarious case the hired private army tried to surrender three times while unable to land their boat due to the workers using cannon fire to prevent them. Eventually they were allowed to surrender.

    Now often the workers had the actual law on their sides, for example in the case of the Luddites, the new mechanical looms made an inferior product and factory owners were simply firing skilled workers in favor of “hiring” child slaves. The Luddites pressed their case to the government and were laughed out parliament (again despite the law being clearly on their side). Only then did they start smashing the looms. The government, decided to side against workers sent in the army. To this day in the UK smashing a loom is a capital offense and many Luddites were hung because of it. In fact you could be hung for simply having been found to have joined the Luddites. It’s not hard to see why anarchists didn’t think state power ever led to anything good given this kind of thing was often how it played out.

    Now the working classes had their own internal conflicts, communists, who famously loved killing fascists liked to kill anarchists even more. Ironically they should have been natural allies against oppression but they weren’t and were thus marginalized and ultimately both factions saw their numbers and power diminish. Two Lies of P factions (the Donkey boss seemed to he part of one faction, sorry I forget their names) are described as hating each other even though they shouldn’t and having been largely smashed by the initial puppet uprising made me think of this dynamic.

    So are the puppets simply trying to throw off the chains of oppression? Are we working, as the player, against our very puppet brothers? Because I’ll tell you what, Hotel Krat sure is filled with a lot of rich, well dressed, upper class people.

    I killed the Vergigny Factory boss yesterday and it didn’t make me feel good. It’s not at all clear that he was the monster that everyone is claiming.

    And here I am as P, trying to become “more human” (aka one of the upper class) by lying (something puppets supposedly cannot do) and having an imagination, listening to music (the ignorant masses could never appreciate Bach, right?) and aping a bunch of other “human” behavior.

    Gepetto even casts a little fuel on this fire by wondering out loud to us about whether these puppets have free will or is that impossible and they’re merely being controlled by a nefarious unseen force (again, echos of anti communist sentiment in the west)?

    I certainly don’t know how this shakes out of if the later story justifies or dispels these parallels but I cannot help feeling that I/P might be the bad guy here.
  • Posted on 24 August 24 at 22:35
    You/P being the bad guy depends on what choices you go for with your ending :p

    You may perhaps be interested in reading the original Pinocchio story. I haven't myself so can't really say too much, but I hear it's pretty dark. Fits the whole "souls-like" idea quite well before Disney made it all family friendly. Perhaps you could find more reference to your ideas there, I'd be surprised if the devs took no inspiration from it.
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  • TymanTheLongTymanTheLong555,819
    Posted on 25 August 24 at 18:33
    FruitofPassion said:
    You/P being the bad guy depends on what choices you go for with your ending :p

    You may perhaps be interested in reading the original Pinocchio story. I haven't myself so can't really say too much, but I hear it's pretty dark. Fits the whole "souls-like" idea quite well before Disney made it all family friendly. Perhaps you could find more reference to your ideas there, I'd be surprised if the devs took no inspiration from it.
    Man, now I am torn between trying to rush the end of the game and just looking it up so we and discuss it. I’ll try to read the original Pinnocio today, thanks for the suggestion!
  • TymanTheLongTymanTheLong555,819
    Posted on 25 August 24 at 18:42
    That Fallen Bishop Andreus is just fantastic looking!!! What a creepy monstrosity! And that toothy face!!!

    For the first time I noticed an enemy hardness mechanic (okay I guess the mutating thing that could grow a shield was the first time) where my Salamander Dagger tended to bounce off. I’m not sure I’ve seen a breakdown of how this works in Lies of P, anyone know? In Elden Ring we know how hardness works and it’s why Great Shields tend to have more enemy attacks bounce off them, opening up counters, than smaller shields. If there’s a way to potentially handle it by switching weapons I’d love to know.

    I could have done without the beam walking while dodging those ranged enemies in St. Fragelico Cathedral though. I died more to that cheese than any boss so far! I’m never a fan of these weird jumping and beam skill puzzles the these games. Making your way down the tombstones behind Mohg the Omen on your way to the Frenzied Flame in Elden Ring is another annoying example. Does anyone actually like these or feel accomplished for getting past them? I’m not sure what they add to these games…
  • Posted on 26 August 24 at 23:11
    This genre of game is all about overcoming challenges. Figuring out different ways to approach the problem. I think the "platforming" sections are just that.
    Could also be part lore wise like Dark Souls 1 where it's our way of breaking in since the main path is closed off, not really meant for traversing. But I think gameplay wise it's just a puzzle challenge.
    For Lies of P, it was awhile since I played but there are spots you can stop so enemies attacks hit beams instead of you, and also spots you can rush to them. Try ranged items or poisoning them to death if you wanna take it slow.

    It is indeed a cool area though. Like the ambience a lot. Boss of the area took me more times than I wanted to defeat though xD Probably the game's first real "git gud" moment.
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  • TymanTheLongTymanTheLong555,819
    Posted on 27 August 24 at 01:26
    JohnnyInterfnk said:
    JohnnyInterfnk said:
    Day 4 of Lies of P:

    I hate that clown mini-boss in the Rosa Estelle district.

    I HATE THAT CLOWN MINI-BOSS!

    That is all.
    We meet again Clown Mini-Boss, this time in the swamp.

    But now I'm ready for you, you bulbous bastard.
    I was warned about that jerk and just used throwables on him. Could I have beat him? Probably. Figured I might have my hands full with the end chapter boss and so far I’m not wrong.
  • TymanTheLongTymanTheLong555,819
    Posted on 27 August 24 at 20:58, Edited on 28 August 24 at 19:49 by TymanTheLong
    So The Puppet King/Romeo tried to warn us about what’s going on and we slap his hand away and kill him. Gotta say, P is dumber than hell…

    Waltzing through town afterwards killing grieving puppets and then having to lie to Polendina for some stupid game mechanic just made me feel more like an a-hole.
  • JohnnyInterfnkJohnnyInterfnk1,410,985
    Posted on 28 August 24 at 20:13, Edited on 28 August 24 at 20:57 by JohnnyInterfnk
    Since I finished my second playthrough, I figured I'd do a quick boss rating post over here in the spoiler section.

    Keep in mind: I didn't know the power of throwables until well into the game, so I didn't really use them until the end bosses (and in the second playthrough they were mostly unnecessary again until late-game bosses). Also, I tried not to use a companion specter unless I was getting demolished, so a majority of the below was from "solo" play, though I'll note if I used a specter for specific bosses below.

    (Oh, and I'll hold off giving it a numerical challenge rating since I'm sure different bosses hold a different challenge levels for everyone.)


    1.) Parade Master -- A great opening boss. Really showed you the power of parrying attacks (especially since dodging is so poor early in the game) and prepared you for later boss fights. Move set is simple but fun, and the "head-tear" mid fight adds a good dynamic that comes up a lot in later boss fights. Died 3-4 times before I learned to parry/block instead of flop rolling like I normally do in souls games.

    2.) Scrapped Watchman -- I didn't know what the blue birdbath did the first time I arrived at this boss, and thus my surprise specter tore up this boss on my behalf, so I didn't get a good read on this one my first playthrough (This fight is the reason I tried to avoid using specters in my first few attempts). The second playthrough, I didn't use a specter, and found I liked fighting this boss: it felt like a ramped up Parade Master, with some nice telegraphed movesets and enough chaos to keep you on your toes. The fact you got electric damage even when blocking in the second half of the fight is a bit questionable for an early boss (not a problem by the time I reached him the second playthrough though), but other than that this fight was enjoyable and somewhat challenging. Never died to this puppet (thanks specter!)

    3.) King’s Flame, Fuoco -- This guy wrecked me repeatedly (died maybe 7-8 times to this boss). Turns out, keeping your distance from Fuoco is a very, very bad idea. Once I figured out to fight him constantly in close quarters, he stopped chipping my health down with ranged shots and became MUCH more manageable. Simply run when he pulls coals out of his belly, but keep VERY close otherwise, and this fight becomes much easier. I read a lot of people found Fuoco easy, but I didn't because of the above. Valuable lesson learned here, and another boss fight thumbs up from me.

    4.) Fallen Archbishop Andreus -- I facerolled this guy both times I fought him, which was a refreshing change from Fuoco and the Parade Master. I think I did really well because this is the first boss whose moveset meshes well with dodge rolling (my preferred playstyle) AND is the first boss in my opinion with very telegraphed, non-stuttered attacks. Keep to the side and hack at the belly -- the Souls standard way of fighting! This is the way! The second part of the fight where there are two "heads" to the boss and it has different movesets based on what head you're facing is a fun gimmick but didn't change the fight too much, since the strategy was again stay at the side and hack away. This was the first boss where I felt I did better against the boss than the general community did as a whole. A feeling that won't last...

    5.) Eldest of the Black Rabbit Brotherhood -- Died 4-5 times here until I learned the trick of running across the arena to separate the Eldest from his kin so that you can fight them separately. Once you do this, each individual is very manageable. Valuable lesson learned here -- you have THREE defense moves, not two. Block/parry, dodge, and RUN. (Well, actually four defense moves, see below...)

    Bonus A.) White Lady -- I'm skipping most Stalker fights as they're somewhat similar (parry-time, repost, use blocking objects to your advantage if available), but I wanted to note this one specifically because it was my favorite. The White Lady is the first stalker who is LIGHTNING fast, and has a somewhat-unique move set, and combine that with a neat introduction and a fun arena and you have my favorite stalker fight of the game. I died 2-3 times here until I learned CIRCLE STRAFING (which, apparently, I forgot somewhere in this mess), after which this fight became much easier. Backstabbing in this game is very fickle, which is why I didn't do it often (I would parry-repost other stalkers like the Survivor) but circle strafing was key here. A very fun fight.

    Bonus B.) Mad Clown Puppet -- Including this mini-boss here because I HATED this guy. Rolls a giant ball of flame at you, comes down the hill with two flamethrower adds, has an ENORMOUS health pool, has no weaknesses (that I ever became aware of), attacks hit like a MAC truck, has an ANNOYINGLY long attack that hits you when trying to heal, and most-annoyingly has an un-telegraphed "belly-bump" attack that I cannot parry for the life of me. Took me three or four attempts to take this jerk down the first time I saw him. His only saving grace is his stupid spin attack is easily parry-timed (assuming you remember the slow-down at the end and the "f-u" uppercut after). This is the ONLY mini-boss I had a rough time with, and he shows up AGAIN in the swamp level! HATED THIS GUY! (And yes, you should run past him initially to the Stargazer behind him, save there, then lead him back to the stargazer area to fight him, thereby avoiding adds. I didn't know this because I was playing without a guide. Bleh.)

    6.) Romeo, King of Puppets -- The first boss where the first and second phases are extremely different, I liked how the typical large-boss keep-your-distance-and-wait-for-opportunities fight transitioned into a super-fast frenetic parry-fest. I think this boss is high on people's "tough" list specifically due to this extreme shift in fight tactics. I found the first half easily manageable but the second half to be quite difficult. The key to the second half I found is just to RUN when his weapons light up in flames, or else get prepared to be wombo-comboed to death! Then, parry-repost when he's back to normal attacks. I think I died 8-10 times in this fight before I got used to the second phase. In my second playthrough I was able to defeat the King the first-time, mostly because of the muscle memory from the first time around.

    7.) Champion Victor -- I think I died once to this boss. This boss is the one I remember the least, though I do remember that it felt like a boss battle from the Arkham series of games (probably because he's one of the only bosses who talks to you before and during the fight). Like a boxer mini-boss, but bigger and faster. Move set seemed pretty simple, abet fast. I also remember that he had two phases to the fight, and the second phase being easier somehow than the first. Anyone else have this experience, or was I just lucky somehow? Ah well, I'll take the winds where I can get them.

    8.) Green Monster of the Swamp -- Died like 8-10 times to this boss, because again we have a fight in two phases, with each phase being different. Took me awhile to learn to dodge FORWARD when the Green Monster was tunneling after you -- any other direction and you'll get hit. Unlike the Archbishop, I had a hard time staying to the side of this monster, but if you can goad him into doing the Decay spray that's when you can get a bunch of damage in. I LOVED how the second phase combined the move sets from the first phase with the move sets of the Scrapped Watchman -- thought that was a really neat piece of design work. This was the boss fight where I felt the game was starting to ramp up in difficulty (not including the next main boss).

    Bonus C.) Walker of Illusions -- Died too many times here (4-5 I think) due to dodge-rolling into scenery and getting walloped. Was disappointed that the gimmick here, duplication, was essentially a non-issue as the original and duplicate don't fight at the same time, and the duplicate dies very, very quickly. After a lot of bosses with heavy dodge, I remembered that I probably should parry here, and that's when I finally took the Walker out. Got my revenge on the Walker the second playthrough though, just steamrolling over him (her?) like nothing (though to be fair, I was probably VERY over leveled by that time). Side note: I'm not sure if this boss is optional or not. Can you just duck out the side door and avoid this fight? I never tested it...

    9.) Corrupted Parade Master -- Easiest boss in the game. Just wait for him to do his flop-and-crawl attack, and counterattack afterwards (and you'll be full stamina if you just walk backwards to avoid the flop-and-crawl attack). Like above, the add was a non-issue, only really soaking some damage dished out after the flop-crawl. I did die once though as I was getting the pattern down, and that's more deaths than the Archbishop got out of me, so credit where credit is due I guess.

    10.) Black Rabbit Brotherhood -- Confession time. Here is where I starting using a specter, mostly because I didn't feel like dealing with multiple attackers at one time. As such, this only took me two attempts (my first failed one solo, then the successful one with a specter). I think the gimmick here is you have to kill the last two brothers close together or the Eldest comes back and double-teams you to death, but with a specter in tow this was a non-issue, and in my second playthrough (where I completed this solo) I was so over-leveled that the Brotherhood double-team was a non-issue (they don't attack together, so it's easy to handle them one-on-one). I felt bad about using a specter in this fight, and then I met Laxasia later. Didn't feel so bad after that.

    11.) Door Guardian -- A bit of a gimmick fight where you have to target the small leg. Died 4-5 times before I got frustrated by the lack of damage I was doing and looked it up online to see what I was doing wrong (and then felt dumb for having to look it up). Once you know you have to stagger/fatal attack by targeting the small leg, I just used the Devastation Grinder and the fight was much, much easier. I did learn from this fight that Shock is the most annoying status effect of the game, bar none.

    12.) Laxasia -- This was the fight that broke me. Phase one is very tough (a !!!!thirteen!!!! swing combo attack!) but at least its manageable. Then phase two begins, and I die in 30 seconds. Insane speed, VERY weird and unwieldly parry times, a flying attack that all but lands 100% of the time, and lightning effects that are super distracting and ABSOLUTELY mess up blocking and parry timing. This is, BY FAR, the hardest fight in the game, bar none. To counter, I brough the specter along, but STILL died (just like me, the specter gets WRECKED in phase two). THEN I decided to learn the joys of throwables, and EVEN THEN, I barely squeaked by. This fight, no doubt, is up there with the legends Ornstein and Smough as the most annoying, most difficult fight in all of souls-likes. At least here you have the mercy of specters and throwables to carry you through, (unlike the upcoming final, final boss of the game).

    13.) Simon Manus -- Maybe I was still in Laxasia shock (pun!), but it only took two attempts to kill Simon Manus. Phase one is surprisingly easy for an end-game boss, with telegraphed attacks and manageable parry times. Phase two is much harder however, with annoying projectiles and a "Hand of God" attack thrown in that can one shot you if not careful (hence my first death). I did use Shot Puts to stagger Simon this fight admittedly (I became addicted to them after the Laxasia fight), though I don't think it was really necessary. I also had a specter fight with me the second time (after Laxasia, I figured this fight would be just as bad, but wasn't), but I didn't really feel I needed him, and didn't bother using him for my second playthrough.

    14.) Nameless Puppet -- Do you like parrying? I hope you do because you're going to do a LOT of it here during this fight. Died 9-10 times during this fight -- the first phase is pretty manageable, but you really need to excel at parrying as you'll need almost ALL of your heals for the second phase, where things are turned up to 11. As the final fight of the game, I think this fight was extremely balanced and appropriate -- extremely tough but still fair. Both times I faced the Nameless Puppet, I did use throwables, as I switched to a weapon with a slower heavy attack so I used Shot Puts to trigger staggered states (and admittedly, I pummeled the Nameless Puppet with throwables during his last 20-30 of life in phase two. No shame here.). Given that, this fight took a LOT of patience to get through phase two, but I was able to pull it off.

    And that's my list! All fight in this game seemed fair, minus Laxasia, which at least can be overcome with specters and throwables if needed. Also notable is that each boss fight felt like it played to a certain style of defense, which made the game feel like you learned a new "skill" for most every boss, which is quite an accomplishment. All in all, I feel this game had extremely well design boss fights, and that lends heavily to the 5/5 score I gave the game.

    Anyway, feel free to critique my impressions, especially if you had a VASTLY different time than I did with a certain boss or two.



    .
  • JohnnyInterfnkJohnnyInterfnk1,410,985
    Posted on 28 August 24 at 21:06
    One final item from be before I retire:

    My favorite moment from Lies of P.

    Venigni Works. The Shovel Guard. Aka the Furnace Mini-Boss Guys. I was having a REALLY tough time with them early in the game. Got so fed up I spent like 5 minutes slowly goading one to follow me (mobs turn around after a time to return to their patrol path, but if you plink them, they'll follow you a little more). Had it follow, had it follow, had it follow. Finally, I was able to get it into the tunnel with the rolling fireballs, and I HAD THE FIREBALL TUNNEL SMASH UP THE SHOVEL GUARD MINI-BOSS ON MY BEHALF!

    WAHAHAHAHA! SWEET VICTORY IS MINE. Got to watch the Shovel Guard repeatedly get pancaked by rolling fireballs until eventually it was defeated, while I sat there and got to enjoy every moment.

    Cheating? Maybe. But it was a huge moral victory for me and my favorite memory of the game.
  • Posted on 28 August 24 at 22:12
    It's funny reading your list JohnnyInterfnk to how I had things where like the furnace boss I found rather easy (hiding behind pillars for the win :p) but yet bishop I was stuck on for a long time :/

    The elder brother was the only boss I gave in to cheesing. I was using the scythe weapon which heavy attack extends it's swing, plus special attack can whirlwind swing. So used poison's and the little stalagmite in the arena to keep him separated and so could attack him through it. That fight was unfun and of all the bosses I would have liked to have a rematch with, it was definitely not them.

    Also used the auto deflecting on Laxasia for phase 2 lightning. So kinda counts as cheese too. I woulda liked to just master the moesets but was playing off game pass so my time was limited.
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  • TymanTheLongTymanTheLong555,819
    Posted on 29 August 24 at 01:24, Edited on 29 August 24 at 01:25 by TymanTheLong
    JohnnyInterfnk said:
    One final item from be before I retire:

    My favorite moment from Lies of P.

    Venigni Works. The Shovel Guard. Aka the Furnace Mini-Boss Guys. I was having a REALLY tough time with them early in the game. Got so fed up I spent like 5 minutes slowly goading one to follow me (mobs turn around after a time to return to their patrol path, but if you plink them, they'll follow you a little more). Had it follow, had it follow, had it follow. Finally, I was able to get it into the tunnel with the rolling fireballs, and I HAD THE FIREBALL TUNNEL SMASH UP THE SHOVEL GUARD MINI-BOSS ON MY BEHALF!

    WAHAHAHAHA! SWEET VICTORY IS MINE. Got to watch the Shovel Guard repeatedly get pancaked by rolling fireballs until eventually it was defeated, while I sat there and got to enjoy every moment.

    Cheating? Maybe. But it was a huge moral victory for me and my favorite memory of the game.
    Leashing elite enemies and leading them to better locations is absolutely fair. That shield puppet on the beams in the Grand Exhibition is absolute crap, lead him away or blow him up with a Fable Art! Lead the big guys out of poison areas, heck the rolling balls are a great idea!

    My least favorite puppet is that stupid Harlequin one in the basement of the mall, I got sick of him and just threw bombs at the last half of his health finally.
  • TymanTheLongTymanTheLong555,819
    Posted on 29 August 24 at 01:32
    JohnnyInterfnk said:
    Since I finished my second playthrough, I figured I'd do a quick boss rating post over here in the spoiler section.

    Keep in mind: I didn't know the power of throwables until well into the game, so I didn't really use them until the end bosses (and in the second playthrough they were mostly unnecessary again until late-game bosses). Also, I tried not to use a companion specter unless I was getting demolished, so a majority of the below was from "solo" play, though I'll note if I used a specter for specific bosses below.

    (Oh, and I'll hold off giving it a numerical challenge rating since I'm sure different bosses hold a different challenge levels for everyone.)


    1.) Parade Master -- A great opening boss. Really showed you the power of parrying attacks (especially since dodging is so poor early in the game) and prepared you for later boss fights. Move set is simple but fun, and the "head-tear" mid fight adds a good dynamic that comes up a lot in later boss fights. Died 3-4 times before I learned to parry/block instead of flop rolling like I normally do in souls games.

    2.) Scrapped Watchman -- I didn't know what the blue birdbath did the first time I arrived at this boss, and thus my surprise specter tore up this boss on my behalf, so I didn't get a good read on this one my first playthrough (This fight is the reason I tried to avoid using specters in my first few attempts). The second playthrough, I didn't use a specter, and found I liked fighting this boss: it felt like a ramped up Parade Master, with some nice telegraphed movesets and enough chaos to keep you on your toes. The fact you got electric damage even when blocking in the second half of the fight is a bit questionable for an early boss (not a problem by the time I reached him the second playthrough though), but other than that this fight was enjoyable and somewhat challenging. Never died to this puppet (thanks specter!)

    3.) King’s Flame, Fuoco -- This guy wrecked me repeatedly (died maybe 7-8 times to this boss). Turns out, keeping your distance from Fuoco is a very, very bad idea. Once I figured out to fight him constantly in close quarters, he stopped chipping my health down with ranged shots and became MUCH more manageable. Simply run when he pulls coals out of his belly, but keep VERY close otherwise, and this fight becomes much easier. I read a lot of people found Fuoco easy, but I didn't because of the above. Valuable lesson learned here, and another boss fight thumbs up from me.

    4.) Fallen Archbishop Andreus -- I facerolled this guy both times I fought him, which was a refreshing change from Fuoco and the Parade Master. I think I did really well because this is the first boss whose moveset meshes well with dodge rolling (my preferred playstyle) AND is the first boss in my opinion with very telegraphed, non-stuttered attacks. Keep to the side and hack at the belly -- the Souls standard way of fighting! This is the way! The second part of the fight where there are two "heads" to the boss and it has different movesets based on what head you're facing is a fun gimmick but didn't change the fight too much, since the strategy was again stay at the side and hack away. This was the first boss where I felt I did better against the boss than the general community did as a whole. A feeling that won't last...

    5.) Eldest of the Black Rabbit Brotherhood -- Died 4-5 times here until I learned the trick of running across the arena to separate the Eldest from his kin so that you can fight them separately. Once you do this, each individual is very manageable. Valuable lesson learned here -- you have THREE defense moves, not two. Block/parry, dodge, and RUN. (Well, actually four defense moves, see below...)

    Bonus A.) White Lady -- I'm skipping most Stalker fights as they're somewhat similar (parry-time, repost, use blocking objects to your advantage if available), but I wanted to note this one specifically because it was my favorite. The White Lady is the first stalker who is LIGHTNING fast, and has a somewhat-unique move set, and combine that with a neat introduction and a fun arena and you have my favorite stalker fight of the game. I died 2-3 times here until I learned CIRCLE STRAFING (which, apparently, I forgot somewhere in this mess), after which this fight became much easier. Backstabbing in this game is very fickle, which is why I didn't do it often (I would parry-repost other stalkers like the Survivor) but circle strafing was key here. A very fun fight.

    Bonus B.) Mad Clown Puppet -- Including this mini-boss here because I HATED this guy. Rolls a giant ball of flame at you, comes down the hill with two flamethrower adds, has an ENORMOUS health pool, has no weaknesses (that I ever became aware of), attacks hit like a MAC truck, has an ANNOYINGLY long attack that hits you when trying to heal, and most-annoyingly has an un-telegraphed "belly-bump" attack that I cannot parry for the life of me. Took me three or four attempts to take this jerk down the first time I saw him. His only saving grace is his stupid spin attack is easily parry-timed (assuming you remember the slow-down at the end and the "f-u" uppercut after). This is the ONLY mini-boss I had a rough time with, and he shows up AGAIN in the swamp level! HATED THIS GUY! (And yes, you should run past him initially to the Stargazer behind him, save there, then lead him back to the stargazer area to fight him, thereby avoiding adds. I didn't know this because I was playing without a guide. Bleh.)

    6.) Romeo, King of Puppets -- The first boss where the first and second phases are extremely different, I liked how the typical large-boss keep-your-distance-and-wait-for-opportunities fight transitioned into a super-fast frenetic parry-fest. I think this boss is high on people's "tough" list specifically due to this extreme shift in fight tactics. I found the first half easily manageable but the second half to be quite difficult. The key to the second half I found is just to RUN when his weapons light up in flames, or else get prepared to be wombo-comboed to death! Then, parry-repost when he's back to normal attacks. I think I died 8-10 times in this fight before I got used to the second phase. In my second playthrough I was able to defeat the King the first-time, mostly because of the muscle memory from the first time around.

    7.) Champion Victor -- I think I died once to this boss. This boss is the one I remember the least, though I do remember that it felt like a boss battle from the Arkham series of games (probably because he's one of the only bosses who talks to you before and during the fight). Like a boxer mini-boss, but bigger and faster. Move set seemed pretty simple, abet fast. I also remember that he had two phases to the fight, and the second phase being easier somehow than the first. Anyone else have this experience, or was I just lucky somehow? Ah well, I'll take the winds where I can get them.

    8.) Green Monster of the Swamp -- Died like 8-10 times to this boss, because again we have a fight in two phases, with each phase being different. Took me awhile to learn to dodge FORWARD when the Green Monster was tunneling after you -- any other direction and you'll get hit. Unlike the Archbishop, I had a hard time staying to the side of this monster, but if you can goad him into doing the Decay spray that's when you can get a bunch of damage in. I LOVED how the second phase combined the move sets from the first phase with the move sets of the Scrapped Watchman -- thought that was a really neat piece of design work. This was the boss fight where I felt the game was starting to ramp up in difficulty (not including the next main boss).

    Bonus C.) Walker of Illusions -- Died too many times here (4-5 I think) due to dodge-rolling into scenery and getting walloped. Was disappointed that the gimmick here, duplication, was essentially a non-issue as the original and duplicate don't fight at the same time, and the duplicate dies very, very quickly. After a lot of bosses with heavy dodge, I remembered that I probably should parry here, and that's when I finally took the Walker out. Got my revenge on the Walker the second playthrough though, just steamrolling over him (her?) like nothing (though to be fair, I was probably VERY over leveled by that time). Side note: I'm not sure if this boss is optional or not. Can you just duck out the side door and avoid this fight? I never tested it...

    9.) Corrupted Parade Master -- Easiest boss in the game. Just wait for him to do his flop-and-crawl attack, and counterattack afterwards (and you'll be full stamina if you just walk backwards to avoid the flop-and-crawl attack). Like above, the add was a non-issue, only really soaking some damage dished out after the flop-crawl. I did die once though as I was getting the pattern down, and that's more deaths than the Archbishop got out of me, so credit where credit is due I guess.

    10.) Black Rabbit Brotherhood -- Confession time. Here is where I starting using a specter, mostly because I didn't feel like dealing with multiple attackers at one time. As such, this only took me two attempts (my first failed one solo, then the successful one with a specter). I think the gimmick here is you have to kill the last two brothers close together or the Eldest comes back and double-teams you to death, but with a specter in tow this was a non-issue, and in my second playthrough (where I completed this solo) I was so over-leveled that the Brotherhood double-team was a non-issue (they don't attack together, so it's easy to handle them one-on-one). I felt bad about using a specter in this fight, and then I met Laxasia later. Didn't feel so bad after that.

    11.) Door Guardian -- A bit of a gimmick fight where you have to target the small leg. Died 4-5 times before I got frustrated by the lack of damage I was doing and looked it up online to see what I was doing wrong (and then felt dumb for having to look it up). Once you know you have to stagger/fatal attack by targeting the small leg, I just used the Devastation Grinder and the fight was much, much easier. I did learn from this fight that Shock is the most annoying status effect of the game, bar none.

    12.) Laxasia -- This was the fight that broke me. Phase one is very tough (a !!!!thirteen!!!! swing combo attack!) but at least its manageable. Then phase two begins, and I die in 30 seconds. Insane speed, VERY weird and unwieldly parry times, a flying attack that all but lands 100% of the time, and lightning effects that are super distracting and ABSOLUTELY mess up blocking and parry timing. This is, BY FAR, the hardest fight in the game, bar none. To counter, I brough the specter along, but STILL died (just like me, the specter gets WRECKED in phase two). THEN I decided to learn the joys of throwables, and EVEN THEN, I barely squeaked by. This fight, no doubt, is up there with the legends Ornstein and Smough as the most annoying, most difficult fight in all of souls-likes. At least here you have the mercy of specters and throwables to carry you through, (unlike the upcoming final, final boss of the game).

    13.) Simon Manus -- Maybe I was still in Laxasia shock (pun!), but it only took two attempts to kill Simon Manus. Phase one is surprisingly easy for an end-game boss, with telegraphed attacks and manageable parry times. Phase two is much harder however, with annoying projectiles and a "Hand of God" attack thrown in that can one shot you if not careful (hence my first death). I did use Shot Puts to stagger Simon this fight admittedly (I became addicted to them after the Laxasia fight), though I don't think it was really necessary. I also had a specter fight with me the second time (after Laxasia, I figured this fight would be just as bad, but wasn't), but I didn't really feel I needed him, and didn't bother using him for my second playthrough.

    14.) Nameless Puppet -- Do you like parrying? I hope you do because you're going to do a LOT of it here during this fight. Died 9-10 times during this fight -- the first phase is pretty manageable, but you really need to excel at parrying as you'll need almost ALL of your heals for the second phase, where things are turned up to 11. As the final fight of the game, I think this fight was extremely balanced and appropriate -- extremely tough but still fair. Both times I faced the Nameless Puppet, I did use throwables, as I switched to a weapon with a slower heavy attack so I used Shot Puts to trigger staggered states (and admittedly, I pummeled the Nameless Puppet with throwables during his last 20-30 of life in phase two. No shame here.). Given that, this fight took a LOT of patience to get through phase two, but I was able to pull it off.

    And that's my list! All fight in this game seemed fair, minus Laxasia, which at least can be overcome with specters and throwables if needed. Also notable is that each boss fight felt like it played to a certain style of defense, which made the game feel like you learned a new "skill" for most every boss, which is quite an accomplishment. All in all, I feel this game had extremely well design boss fights, and that lends heavily to the 5/5 score I gave the game.

    Anyway, feel free to critique my impressions, especially if you had a VASTLY different time than I did with a certain boss or two.



    .
    Great summary! I think Romeo is a real skill check. Those phase two attacks are brutal and fast, even with a Spectre. I did learn something about weapon wielding enemies in general though, from a shovel puppet of all things, dodging one direction vs the other are not equal vs weapon wielding enemies. Shovel puppets and Romeo will totally hit you if you dodge to the right (your right) and not if you dodge left.

    Romeo took me several tries and it’s also when I learned the joys of Aegis leveled to level 2, being able to hold block and attack is really good and made the difference. I also think shot puts are a good idea vs fast enemies so you land your other throwables. Take one sure shot with a shot put then unload a stack of bombs while they’re stunned.

    I actually staggered Romeo and just kept throwing bombs, it seemed like the better part of valor.

    Victor seemed super easy in comparison.
  • TymanTheLongTymanTheLong555,819
    Posted on 29 August 24 at 18:28
    Question for everyone: what weapons did you end up feeling like were your workhorses?

    For me I’m getting bored of it, but I’m an Advance build and Electric Coil Stick is so good against puppets I use it a ton, but my absolute favorite is Salamander Dagger blade on the Acidic Spear handle. This gives you nice reach, S Advance scaling from spending two cranks, an obscene Y Fable Art that boosts Fire damage for what seems like an excessively long time, and a Piercing only moveset on a one handed weapon that feels like it has almost the reach of a two handed weapon. It attacks fast as heck, and Charged Heavy charges quickly and does a double stab that moves forward quite a ways. Not to mention Overheat adds an extra 40% Fire damage when you inflict it on the enemy.

    So yeah, Salamander Blade + Acidic Spear handle is probably my favorite weapon. Took down the swamp boss on my second try last night with it.

    None of the boss ergo weapons from Alidoro scale with Advance so I haven’t tried any of them out yet. I hear the Romeo ergo weapon and the swamp boss ergo weapon (sabre) are amazing though.
  • Cylon 118Cylon 118718,473
    Posted on 30 August 24 at 00:11
    I actually ended up falling in love with the umbrella boss weapon. Its damage isnt to high but it makes up for that with speed. When i was stuck on the nameless puppet for new game plus for like an hour switching to umbrella got me it within 2 or 3 tries and then play through 3 i just stuck with it and all was smooth.
  • TymanTheLongTymanTheLong555,819
    Posted on 30 August 24 at 00:36
    Cylon 118 said:
    I actually ended up falling in love with the umbrella boss weapon. Its damage isnt to high but it makes up for that with speed. When i was stuck on the nameless puppet for new game plus for like an hour switching to umbrella got me it within 2 or 3 tries and then play through 3 i just stuck with it and all was smooth.
    Nice! I’ll have go check that one out too.

    I guess while I was at it I should have asked about Legion arms. The Aegis has ended up being my favorite, gotten me a few boss downs in a pinch. The counter attack is amazing if you can pull it off but not worth trying vs very fast bosses. But even at level 2 being able to attack during a guard is outstanding and recharging a Legion arm is cheap, consumable wise. I started off with the Flame one and found it useful vs the bishop boss, but if I’m using it I’m not attacking and I can already easily set bosses on fire (Overheat) with my Salamander Dagger blade.

    I do prefer the Aegis with a long handle vs many enemies against which I use it (even mini bosses and elite enemies), as they often have weapons or just long arms and can hit you at a longer range than something like the Electric Coil Stick. I haven’t tested it with two handed weapon handles yet so I don’t know what the attack while blocking is like there.
  • Cylon 118Cylon 118718,473
    Posted on 30 August 24 at 00:47
    I mainly used the electric arm its capable of one hit killing alot of enemies at full power and knocking over big guys as long as u time it right as its range is well low but it is pretty useless in boss fights. I just never really relied on the arms too much and didnt experiment with them nearly enough i think.
  • bdp123bdp1231,512,327
    Posted on 30 August 24 at 12:14
    How long is the story for lies of P
    Bdp123
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