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Fumbling The Handoff

  • JGSLabJGSLab185,405
    Posted on 24 July 16 at 16:24Permalink
    I would disagree regarding bioshock 2

    A more destroyed rapture, new weapons, plasmids duel wielding both and interesting characters

    Bioshock Infinite was very dull by comparison, vigors were dull, weapons also and for me a personal peeve was there was no change on the weapon when you upgraded the tear were very underwhelming

    A 20 minute interactive cut scene to explain everything the most irritating boss fight with the ghost and also for a city in the clouds in amazing how often you are stuck inside a building with 4 walls and a roof and how easy the game abandons and forgets that.
  • zoidberg1339zoidberg1339401,783
    Posted on 24 July 16 at 16:31Permalink
    I'm glad you mentioned the wonderful Fallout New Vegas. I preferred it to FO3 and in some ways I prefer it to FO4.
  • Posted on 24 July 16 at 19:08Permalink
    New Vegas did in my opinion have some great dlc, by the best in the series with stuff like Real Old World Blues, but all of the innovations and what made it refreshing was done by Fallout 3, and I love Obsidian, but even the story was just fallout 3 moved from the east coast to the southwest.

    And honestly you people are trying to argue semantics, oh well high ratings and high sales, means only popularity, but ultimately what is something that is good, something that is liked. Your argument will probably be, no its something you can base on objective techniques, but there is no such thing as objective techniques when it comes to the subjective. So with out having any defined scientific methods to just something like good or great, all you are left with is gathering a preponderance of subjective "facts" like sales and critical ratings. Even something like Avatar which I think is garbage, made as much money as it did, and was popular as it was due the innovation in cinematic techniques. Same reason Citizen Kane is popular.

    Honestly the one thing that ruined Bioshock 2 for me was not making subject delta the actual father, that to me one have resonated more, also the like bioshock one , the ending was kind of weak.
  • AckterAckter324,975
    Posted on 24 July 16 at 19:47Permalink
    Multiple ways to complete a quest will always be superior to only one way of completing a quest.

    That's not subjective at all.
  • KyoKyo896,852
    Posted on 24 July 16 at 20:14Permalink
    VoodooTrumpet said:
    Am I the only person in the world who thought Infinite was awful?

    New Vegas was also better than Fallout 3, in my opinion.
    I hate the entire Bioshock series. If that counts.
    And I agree about New Vegas.
  • Posted on 24 July 16 at 20:28Permalink
    I liked them all
    Alwayzlifted
  • Posted on 24 July 16 at 21:00Permalink
    Ackter said:
    Multiple ways to complete a quest will always be superior to only one way of completing a quest.

    That's not subjective at all.
    Though I would assume most people agree with you, this is still an opinion and still subjective.
  • Posted on 24 July 16 at 21:36Permalink
    mark has a point. from what ive seen today, there are more "filler" cash grabs games than there are true continuations. also, it certainly doesnt help that the "fillers" are made not by the original company who made them.

    examples:

    halo 4/5 - many people still like and play them now but i know myself and many other lifelong halo fans gave up after 3 (i was done after reach)

    gears of war judgment - wow, talk about almost 0 substance. seriously, who asked and wanted a game starring the fourth member of delta squad? i certainly didnt

    borderlands pre-sequel - fun ill admit but only good things i saw there was the gladiator class and the cryo element. also, it certainly felt less in quantity compared to 2

    batman arkham origins - it plays almost exactly like city. talk about taking almost 0 chances

    reboot DmC - oh good lord. talk about a shameless reboot. i wont go further into that one
  • Bar6arianBar6arian514,872
    Posted on 24 July 16 at 22:54Permalink
    Embrace change as its the only thing you can count on. I think Gears 4 will do great but won't be like the original for me so I'll more than likely pass on it.
    “The oldest and strongest emotion of mankind is fear, and the oldest and strongest kind of fear is fear of the unknown.” - H.P. Lovecraft
  • Posted on 25 July 16 at 00:52Permalink
    For people who want to say 2's story was better than Infinite's all I can say is you just didn't get it. Nevermind all the sub-texts throughout the masterpiece that was Infinite, the surface story alone was better, deeper and more moving than most games even can try to approach being. Maybe it's just to much for some to wrap their heads around and therefore they dismiss/reduce it's brilliance.

    Apologies for the rant.
  • Daelus1Daelus1469,272
    Posted on 25 July 16 at 01:45Permalink
    lmao.....always entertaining reading the comment section on this site.....Ackter, I really can't tell if you just like to argue, or if you are simply that special....nevertheless, keep it up, def amusing.

    My 2 cents....
    Infinite was an average game with a top notch atmosphere.
    1 was overrated junk and 2 is more properly (still too high imo....but I wouldn't argue against the clear majority) rated junk....I still have nightmares of turret hacking!!

    FO3 and FONV were both amazing games. Bethesda is the undisputed champ of open worlf sandbox RPGs......Obsidian took that sandbox and wrote a stronger narrative.....just diff styles....what Bethesda does is the genius part and the far rarer treat.

    Love all ME...ME2 is the best in the series for me....and it's not close.

    Shooters...don't play....comic book heroes...don't play :)
  • MugenKairoMugenKairo252,581
    Posted on 25 July 16 at 02:55Permalink
    Necromorph11 said:
    bioshock 2 was better than infinite both gameplay and story wise
    I never played Bioshock 2 but only because of the tacked-on MP. I may simply be a case of the studio doing their best but not having the same elite product standards as the original studio. I know Batman Origins pushed through and minimised QA, something Rocksteady would never have done.
    'Life begins beyond the edge of your comfort zone'
  • KyoKyo896,852
    Posted on 25 July 16 at 03:19Permalink
    Daelus1 said:
    Bethesda is the undisputed champ of open worlf sandbox RPGs.
    I could not disagree more. Outside of Morrowind, their games are kind of boring in my opinion and way to geared toward the casual market with the amount of handholding their series have. Plus they are always always riddled with bugs, and they are to lazy or maybe untalented to change engines to make better looking games. I mean how long do they plan on sticking with the gamebryo engine? Only way I can stomach their games these days is because the PC community does all the work for them in making their games better via mods lol.

    There are a ton of good open world games around...just not many of them seem to ever work their way on to consoles.
  • TheMaizeTheMaize1,220,094
    Posted on 25 July 16 at 04:30, Edited on 25 July 16 at 04:34 by TheMaizePermalink
    Kyo said:
    Daelus1 said:
    Bethesda is the undisputed champ of open worlf sandbox RPGs.
    I could not disagree more. Outside of Morrowind, their games are kind of boring in my opinion and way to geared toward the casual market with the amount of handholding their series have. Plus they are always always riddled with bugs, and they are to lazy or maybe untalented to change engines to make better looking games. I mean how long do they plan on sticking with the gamebryo engine? Only way I can stomach their games these days is because the PC community does all the work for them in making their games better via mods lol.

    There are a ton of good open world games around...just not many of them seem to ever work their way on to consoles.
    Skyrim was one of the best looking games last gen, if you installed it on the HD...Fallout looks great aswell, without overly impressing though...but i never found graphics to be a negative in a bethesda game..
    Bugs are harder to avoid in such big games...you can test them, but not in a way that will cover everything that millions of players will do in a world that size...
    As the people who "invented" openworld, even if you dont like these games, they propably influenced a lot of your favourite developers..

    Taste is subjective, so i wont argue on other peoples favourites...but if we are talking elder scrolls and fallout games, my top 5 is:
    1. Daggerfall
    2. Fallout 2
    3. Arena
    4. Morrowind
    5. Skyrim

    Oblivion (and i believe fallout 3 was the same) Are on my shitlist, for being a game the size they are, without any ingame tracking of which dungeons/locations you visited. For some reason i never found it to be an issue in the previous games
  • DANIELJJ14DANIELJJ141,203,976
    Posted on 25 July 16 at 04:51Permalink
    I hated Fallout 3 but only because I had played New Vegas first, not saying it's a bad game but I couldn't get into it since it was like taking ten steps back from NV.

    Borderlands Presequel was awful, as a massive Borderlands fan I'd say that was lazily shit out, poor dialogue and story, character classes were a bit meh, the environments were boring and about 90% of the characters had become Australian which was the stupidest thing about it. Just because it was 2K Australia it wouldn't have killed you to get some variety in your voice actors.

    EA as a publisher murdered Dead Space as a franchise. The original by Visceral was fantastic, 2 was okay, nowhere near as tense or scary as the first far too many action sequences, then what the C**t was number 3, micro transactions in a single player game, being told on a game screen not enough credits, buy more? What a way to remove any chance at immersion into the game.

    I'll finish with Bioshock Infinite, I won't say it's bad because it isn't however it never really grabbed me, I mean I haven't even finished it. The way I see things, if I'm not compelled to finish a game's story then it isn't that exciting, and the comment someone made about the weapons being lacklustre is spot on (a sniper rifle in a Bioshock game really?).

    I don't have an issue with a publisher farming out developers to make so called filler games to go in between their big releases, but if you are going do that and make a game in half the time you plan on making the next proper one, don't try and charge the same bloody amount for it, because it is insulting to us as consumers and disrespectful to legacy of the games themselves.
  • DwabiDwabi142,209
    Posted on 25 July 16 at 06:20Permalink
    ME 2 was the least RPG-like but had the most engaging cinematic experience. The new dialogue interupts are perhaps my favorite thing ever. ME3 had the best mechanics, but that's because I like ARPGs and shooters, if I was an RPG purist I would've been pissed.

    I really want ME4 to be great, but the way 3's story was handled has left me with little faith.

    I actually enjoyed Pre-Seq, and prefer its gameplay. But the story and comedy (especially in the 2nd and 4th DLC) of BL2 is vastly superior. I only hope they are able to make BL3 less repetitive (and if Battleborn is any indication, non-repetitive gameplay is not in their wheelhouse).
  • s3bb86s3bb86374,762
    Posted on 25 July 16 at 08:56Permalink
    Dwabi said:
    ME 2 was the least RPG-like but had the most engaging cinematic experience. The new dialogue interupts are perhaps my favorite thing ever. ME3 had the best mechanics, but that's because I like ARPGs and shooters, if I was an RPG purist I would've been pissed.
    I never thought of ME2 and 3 as RPGs, it is even debateable for ME1 imo. they are story driven shooters with RPG elements. you have a class and some skills attached to them, thats it. no attribute points to use, no crafting system and so on. They are great games, ME3 is in my top 3 for the 360 generation, but at - least for me - no RPGs
    Bayern Munich Supporter and NBA Junkie
  • Darklord1899Darklord1899365,099
    Posted on 25 July 16 at 13:13Permalink
    Hizameon said:
    I like Bioshock 2 WAY more than I like Bioshock Infinite.

    People hated that it was just "Bioshock (1) again" but I liked playing Bioshock so I don't see the problem on that end. I know the story is pretty bland overall but Infinite's story did several things I really didn't like.

    If I were to compare the two games, I'd do it like they were two children with the first game as the parent. Bioshock 2 is the nice child, always following in their parent's footsteps and looks up to them greatly. Bioshock Infinite is the rebellious child who is always talking about how much they are not like their parent, talking about how they do cool things like chain riding and time travel which their parent would NEVER do and talking about how much they are embarrassed by their parent.

    Yet that child will never see or admit that they are more like their parent than they can ever hope to imagine.
    I so agree. Bioshock Airship was a real bore. I really disliked it.
    B2 was a great game. Also it put in mp which was a lot of fun.
  • Kerman7Kerman7665,858
    Posted on 25 July 16 at 16:16, Edited on 25 July 16 at 16:18 by Kerman7Permalink
    Garlyle said:
    [...]
    Unreliable critics and toxic fan culture, combined with the societal scourge that is brand loyalty, has led to the mislabeling of great games as cash grabs, despite the fact that many times, these different takes on the franchises outshine the originals. Most people never gave Bishock 2 or Arkham Origins a chance, just because of the label "cash grab". The few that did however, learned that you should see for yourself how good something is before listening to "professionals" opinions.
    I don't know anything about BS2 nor B:AO, haven't played any of them, but this last section is the most interesting bit coming out of this article and worthy of it's own piece I reckon.
    Makes me think about Nintendo and Pokemon:
    - Pokemon Go comes out and is successful; people think Nintendo made it; Nintendo shares shoot to the roof.
    - People realise Nintendo didn't make it and doesn't own it (Nintendo kindly reminding everyone); Nintendo comes back down.
    Subjective opinions and assessments will never be consistent nor reliable, but they can be manipulated.


    N0T PENNYS B0AT said:
    Garlyle, this is filed as an op-ed. Thanks for reading anyways. smile
    Not sure where it appears as such but good move.
  • Posted on 25 July 16 at 21:58Permalink
    The GB 4x100 relay team have been known to fumble the handoff, too. Just saying.
    In this world gone mad, we won't spank the monkey, the monkey will spank us!
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