Game Discussion: Darksiders Warmastered Edition Forum

Darksiders Warmastered Edition Multi-Genre Discussion

AuthorMessage
Posted on 13 July 17 at 15:31
Please use this thread to discuss this game's classification under the multi-genre system.

If you disagree with the current genres, please click the "Add genre disagreement" button below.
Posted on 13 July 17 at 15:34
Eurydace has registered their disagreement about the genres applied to this game
I believe this deserves a Metroidvania tag. You unlock many new abilities that are used for traversal. While there is no story-based backtracking, there is backtracking for numerous collectibles which do impact gameplay. I believe this should be enough. The backtracking can't be required for story and I can't imagine what more you would need.

I'd also give the tag to Darksiders 2 and 3.
Zonrith1
550,296
Zonrith1
Posted on 13 July 17 at 16:53
I do lean towards applying Metroidvania to all these games. I'd like to see the counter arguments supplied here. Reminder that the genre definition is as follows:

These games are inspired by classic Metroid and Castlevania games, but need not strictly adhere to the original formats. These games usually involve navigating an open or semi-open world using the skills and abilities of the character. A core component of the genre features players earning new abilities and/or items which allow them to explore previously inaccessible areas. Backtracking is also a core element of the genre (often for progression purposes, but not exclusively so). These games can be 2D or 3D and do not need to be Platformers.

To my knowledge they meet the navigation provision, have the core components of gaining the ability to access areas that were inaccessible, and does support fairly extensive backtracking options (even if not mandated for progression). For me, this is a lot of weight to grant them the tag.
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SpiralGamerpro
1,066,551
SpiralGamerpro
Posted on 13 July 17 at 17:00
By this logic, it seems like any game with story-related upgrades and stage select is a Metroidvania.
The people's champion! Well done for an amazing run, and for croaking with dignity. #TeamSporl4lyf - MalibuStacey85
Zonrith1
550,296
Zonrith1
Posted on 13 July 17 at 17:15, Edited on 13 July 17 at 17:15 by Zonrith1
No, upgrades would have to be relevant to accessing inaccessible areas (not just any old upgrades). I also think stage select is suspect as a core element of backtracking, since that seems a lot like a mere chapter select and doesn't embrace a semi-open world (a major issue I had with the notion of Alien: Isolation qualifying). Though I am not ruling stage-select out as a prohibited feature, my default stance is the mechanic goes contrary to what the definition above conveys.

More interested in what Darksiders lacks (or has) that one feels negates it qualifying from the listed genre specifically.
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FFX Brotherhood
Posted on 13 July 17 at 18:21
I personally woudn't consider it a Metroidvania, but that's just because my own personal idea of what a MV is, doesn't fit with the sites.

However Darksiders does have a semi-open world. You do unlock upgrades that allow you back into areas previously inaccessible; back tracking is necessary a few times for story but it is majorly for collectibles IIRC.

I think my only argument for it not being a MV is that I primarily played the old 2D MV games, and as such, in my head only 2D games are what I'd consider MV.

I do feel the Action/Adventure and Hack and Slash do it enough justice.
I do like it when the red stuff comes out.
Zonrith1
550,296
Zonrith1
Posted on 13 July 17 at 20:10
Understood (and fair enough, plenty of other sites mandate 2D aspects to their definition, we just went a different route). Thank you for the feedback.
Eclectic Gamers Podcast: http://eclecticgamers.com
Eurydace
430,591
Eurydace
Posted on 14 July 17 at 05:07
And I will say I misspoke. You do have story-related backtracking in the first game at least.
Zonrith1
550,296
Zonrith1
Posted on 01 August 17 at 13:29, Edited on 01 August 17 at 13:31 by Zonrith1
Clown has agreed with my assessment. Metroidvania is now applied to all the Darksiders games. Thanks all.
Eclectic Gamers Podcast: http://eclecticgamers.com
Awoo
1,049,535
Awoo
Posted on 27 September 17 at 15:54
This is blatantly incorrect. These games are more akin to 3D Zelda games, which I don't think any sane person would say belong in the genre.
What can change the nature of a man?
Eurydace
430,591
Eurydace
Posted on 27 September 17 at 21:02
I would, actually. Absolutely. How is Ocarina of Time not a Metroidvania? Are you saying they can only be 2D? Why?
Awoo
1,049,535
Awoo
Posted on 27 September 17 at 22:14
Not necessarily. Arkham Asylum for example, I would not have a problem saying is a metroidvania. The 3D Zeldas absolutely are not, they do not follow the strict structure that all actual metroidvanias adhere to. You really need to actually go play a few so you can understand what defines them.
What can change the nature of a man?
Eurydace
430,591
Eurydace
Posted on 27 September 17 at 22:44
I've played dozens. I used to only play JRPGs and Metroidvanias for years of my childhood. Functionally, I don't see the difference between Metroidvania and Zelda. Especially considering our site definition, which I believe is quite good (though it also matches every other definition I looked at that didn't require 2D).

These games are inspired by classic Metroid and Castlevania games, but need not strictly adhere to the original formats. These games usually involve navigating an open or semi-open world using the skills and abilities of the character. A core component of the genre features players earning new abilities and/or items which allow them to explore previously inaccessible areas. Backtracking is also a core element of the genre (generally for progression purposes). These games can be 2D or 3D and do not need to be Platformers.
This almost exactly describes Zelda.
Awoo
1,049,535
Awoo
Posted on 12 October 17 at 18:48
If you can't understand the fundamental difference between an open world action-adventure game like Zelda and a Metroidvania, then I don't know what to say to you. The TA definition is garbage, and if you can't see why, you're just hopelessly deluded.
What can change the nature of a man?
Eurydace
430,591
Eurydace
Posted on 12 October 17 at 19:10
Explain. If you can’t be bothered to, then don’t complain smile
Skeptical Mario
Posted on 12 October 17 at 19:25
Despite your tone, I want to understand how we actually disagree.
If I may guess, is it the presence of an overworld and dungeons versus interconnecting zones? Are you saying the latter is a requirement, or that the former disqualifies a game from being a Metroidvania?
Posted on 12 October 17 at 20:11
x Mataeus x has registered their disagreement about the genres applied to this game
Awoo said:
If you can't understand the fundamental difference between an open world action-adventure game like Zelda and a Metroidvania, then I don't know what to say to you. The TA definition is garbage, and if you can't see why, you're just hopelessly deluded.
I think the main issue here is that people are stringently sticking to the guidelines set out by TA verbatim. That in itself should be ok, but it isn't, as the descriptions are sometimes utter nonsense.
So what we have is a load of people deciding on genres for games based on inaccurate descriptions.

The Ori games and Hollow Knight are perfect examples of this. An early 3D example would be Shadowman.

It's not just progressing through to an area to find a key which you need in a previous location - that's just gaming. By that definition, everything from Dizzy to Morrowind would fall under the umbrella. It's about one large, open world where different rooms / areas have various puzzles and collectibles you can't solve / reach until you return with the right ability, of which there are usually a handful.

I would definitely put ReCore into that category, for example, with the core bot abilities.
Skeptical Mario
Posted on 12 October 17 at 20:55
The argument is that Darksiders does have an open world, with collectibles you cannot get until you return with the correct ability.

Does the world need more interconnectedness to qualify? Or, do the areas gated by these abilities need to be larger?
Eurydace
430,591
Eurydace
Posted on 12 October 17 at 21:19
I’d say ReCore is similar to this for sure. Are you saying it shouldn’t be also?
Eurydace
430,591
Eurydace
Posted on 12 October 17 at 21:20
Clearly your issue is with the definition as this game clearly meets the definition. You guys need to explicitly state why the definition is not right.
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